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Post by negativ9002 on Oct 3, 2019 13:24:30 GMT -8
Is This Suggestion A - Add / Change / Remove: Change
Suggestion Summary:
Replacement mechanism of 4x gains for players that are unable to devote hours to the game but still wish to participate in a meaningful way. This mechanism is automated and works on a individual level for each character it is not comparable to GPG(Global Personal Gains)
Suggestion:
The catch up mechanism I propose should work as follows:
A value called the Gain Average will be calculated by taking the average gained amount of a stat per month.
For example if you gained 100 lift per month on average that would be your Gain Average for that stat.
This should be held and updated for each stat as often as possible so it is an accurate representation of how much that specific player would gain if they continued their cycle as they always do.
With the value to gain each month now being know and explained how it is calculated it should be applied in the following fashion:
While offline the mechanism should apply the gain average for each stat to that specific stat each time a month passes. This balances the stat difference for people that are offline and wish to still RP on a similar level to their peers that may have spent the time they were offline, cycling. However this also removes the edge the dedicated players get. The proposed solution to that is as follows:
Players that are actively training gain stats, rating and Personal Gains. Players that are not active and are benefiting from the automated catch up system will only gain stats according to a fixed average from the point they logged off and rating.
This means players that are actively training will have the following advantage: higher personal gains and on average higher stats as their Gain Average would consistently increase while they are online as their regular gains push them further. This helps active players maintain a lead and allow inactive players that still wish to be able to participate in a way that is meaningful while still punishing them in a way for being inactive and those that are too inactive will suffer from very low averages and even lower personal gains that will affect their next generation.
Reason for Suggestion
4x gains appears to be working either too good or too inconsistent due to timer differences and lag. This causes a certain level of frustration with the people that may need it the most.
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Post by cale on Oct 3, 2019 13:37:22 GMT -8
i like the system but there's still the people who will complain about "not being able to keep up with everyone else" even though they're offline.
as long as there's an advantage to those who are able to devote more time to the game and there's a disadvantage to those who can't/don't want to devote more time to the game, there's gonna be the same complaints
my point is, there's not gonna be much different from 4x here, in the end it will yield the same results
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Post by negativ9002 on Oct 3, 2019 13:39:53 GMT -8
caleThis proposed system is not ment to catch everyone up to the exact same level as everyone else. Time that is invested into a character should be rewarded in a way that does not shutdown others. If people do not want this, they are selfish and do not understand how to keep a healthy system of balance while rewarding those that are investing most of their time into this.
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Post by skeletorexplains on Oct 3, 2019 13:53:20 GMT -8
For those who don't know, during the beta a "Catch up" mechanic was added to the 4x system to allow people to catch up to the 'average' level of strength. This doesn't mean you can be #1, but at least get to the average thanks to 4x. gyazo.com/5554aca939b1e1fb544c38fe71943bbe Confirmation here. |
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Post by negativ9002 on Oct 3, 2019 14:04:02 GMT -8
skeletorexplainsThat is interesting to see but yet again this is system is different and in my opinion better than the one you mention. It is different in the sense the average is calculated on a per character basis instead of "The" average. The system you mention is prone to over boost people due to one person being at the very top dragging along everyone at the bottom. The system I propose is not prone to that as the only factor that matter is YOU. YOU as a player influence how it works and no outside force.
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Post by skeletorexplains on Oct 3, 2019 14:52:48 GMT -8
skeletorexplains That is interesting to see but yet again this is system is different and in my opinion better than the one you mention. It is different in the sense the average is calculated on a per character basis instead of "The" average. The system you mention is prone to over boost people due to one person being at the very top dragging along everyone at the bottom. The system I propose is not prone to that as the only factor that matter is YOU. YOU as a player influence how it works and no outside force. This wouldn't be a fair system. This would only mean that the player who is on the most gets the most & it ruins the point. Some of us have jobs & stuff so we can't focus on genesis 24/7. Your idea if i understand it correctly would just give an unfair advantage to the players who maximize their training time in the game & sleep like 3 hours a day. There is always going to be someone on top, that is exactly these people i am talking about. & your system would only allow those people to get even further ahead & leave the average player in the dust. |
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Post by negativ9002 on Oct 3, 2019 15:01:26 GMT -8
skeletorexplains That is interesting to see but yet again this is system is different and in my opinion better than the one you mention. It is different in the sense the average is calculated on a per character basis instead of "The" average. The system you mention is prone to over boost people due to one person being at the very top dragging along everyone at the bottom. The system I propose is not prone to that as the only factor that matter is YOU. YOU as a player influence how it works and no outside force. This wouldn't be a fair system. This would only mean that the player who is on the most gets the most & it ruins the point. Some of us have jobs & stuff so we can't focus on genesis 24/7. Your idea if i understand it correctly would just give an unfair advantage to the players who maximize their training time in the game & sleep like 3 hours a day. There is always going to be someone on top, that is exactly these people i am talking about. & your system would only allow those people to get even further ahead & leave the average player in the dust. I don't think you fully understand how this system is going to work if implemented. The person on TOP only gets to keep their personal gains advantage and a minor stat advantage. This system is designed to keep people as CLOSE as possible to that person who spends 3 hours sleeping and the rest playing without being able to be one on one equal. I believe it is only FAIR to reward effort otherwise there is no point in playing more than X amount of hours because everyone is going to catch up anyway which is the issue with 4x at this time. The average player would not be left in the dust they would be left in the wind trail of that top player. The top player is not undefeatable. It simply will require you to RP with more than two people to beat them or using in game mechanics to beat that top 1% player. WIth 4x gains that undefeatable players CANNOT be defeated with just those mechanics which is a greater issue. Your complaint is simply put "it isn't fair because not everyone is equal." You are right, that is because not everyone is equal everyone cycles differently and is supposed to be different. This system is only ment to allow you to compensate for not being online. Not to compensate for not being as strong as the top 1% because that is your choice and something you can change by putting in more effort. While I accept people have jobs and such but that does not mean the effort of that one person should be taken away. That is unfair. |
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Post by skeletorexplains on Oct 3, 2019 15:15:25 GMT -8
This wouldn't be a fair system. This would only mean that the player who is on the most gets the most & it ruins the point. Some of us have jobs & stuff so we can't focus on genesis 24/7. Your idea if i understand it correctly would just give an unfair advantage to the players who maximize their training time in the game & sleep like 3 hours a day. There is always going to be someone on top, that is exactly these people i am talking about. & your system would only allow those people to get even further ahead & leave the average player in the dust. I don't think you fully understand how this system is going to work if implemented. The person on TOP only gets to keep their personal gains advantage and a minor stat advantage. This system is designed to keep people as CLOSE as possible to that person who spends 3 hours sleeping and the rest playing without being able to be one on one equal. I believe it is only FAIR to reward effort otherwise there is no point in playing more than X amount of hours because everyone is going to catch up anyway which is the issue with 4x at this time. The average player would not be left in the dust they would be left in the wind trail of that top player. The top player is not undefeatable. It simply will require you to RP with more than two people to beat them or using in game mechanics to beat that top 1% player. WIth 4x gains that undefeatable players CANNOT be defeated with just those mechanics which is a greater issue. Your complaint is simply put "it isn't fair because not everyone is equal." You are right, that is because not everyone is equal everyone cycles differently and is supposed to be different. This system is only ment to allow you to compensate for not being online. Not to compensate for not being as strong as the top 1% because that is your choice and something you can change by putting in more effort. While I accept people have jobs and such but that does not mean the effort of that one person should be taken away. That is unfair.Ok by the way you worded it earlier, it sounded like it was essentially (Amount trained) X (month) = Offline Gain amount, to simplify it a lot. Maybe i need more morning coffee. I think a system to allow players to get close to the 1% is fine, as long as the 1% themselves cannot somehow profit off this as well. I don't think anyone wants this game to become like Finale where you train in a hut 24/7 to try & be top dog. However, According to hobbit the "Offline 4x gains" system DOES take account the average gains during that offline period to allow the player to catch up to the other average players. It doesn't just compensate for "Not being online". It is a bit more complex than that. the 1% of players however i feel should be detered from dedicating so much time to training. This isn't Finale, And such 'high effort' in that field shouldn't be rewarded beyond anything IC related. This is a roleplaying game first & foremost, And if people wanna care about how big their numbers are, they can find any Finale rip scattered around. Because lets face it, The 1% don't care about RP. They care about being the strongest. And that sometimes comes at the cost of other peoples RP & ruining the storyline to push themselves as a "main character". No one outside of them finds this fun because they treat the game like a Fighting game & count the amount of kills / "wins" they got. This in turn will make the game leak players. Tl;dr, I think a system to allow players to catch up to the 1% faster is fine, The less training i do the better so i can focus on actually rping, I just don't want this to be used in a way that'll give them more of an advantage than they already have. |
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Post by negativ9002 on Oct 3, 2019 16:00:17 GMT -8
I don't think you fully understand how this system is going to work if implemented. The person on TOP only gets to keep their personal gains advantage and a minor stat advantage. This system is designed to keep people as CLOSE as possible to that person who spends 3 hours sleeping and the rest playing without being able to be one on one equal. I believe it is only FAIR to reward effort otherwise there is no point in playing more than X amount of hours because everyone is going to catch up anyway which is the issue with 4x at this time. The average player would not be left in the dust they would be left in the wind trail of that top player. The top player is not undefeatable. It simply will require you to RP with more than two people to beat them or using in game mechanics to beat that top 1% player. WIth 4x gains that undefeatable players CANNOT be defeated with just those mechanics which is a greater issue. Your complaint is simply put "it isn't fair because not everyone is equal." You are right, that is because not everyone is equal everyone cycles differently and is supposed to be different. This system is only ment to allow you to compensate for not being online. Not to compensate for not being as strong as the top 1% because that is your choice and something you can change by putting in more effort. While I accept people have jobs and such but that does not mean the effort of that one person should be taken away. That is unfair.Ok by the way you worded it earlier, it sounded like it was essentially (Amount trained) X (month) = Offline Gain amount, to simplify it a lot. Maybe i need more morning coffee. I think a system to allow players to get close to the 1% is fine, as long as the 1% themselves cannot somehow profit off this as well. I don't think anyone wants this game to become like Finale where you train in a hut 24/7 to try & be top dog. However, According to hobbit the "Offline 4x gains" system DOES take account the average gains during that offline period to allow the player to catch up to the other average players. It doesn't just compensate for "Not being online". It is a bit more complex than that. the 1% of players however i feel should be detered from dedicating so much time to training. This isn't Finale, And such 'high effort' in that field shouldn't be rewarded beyond anything IC related. This is a roleplaying game first & foremost, And if people wanna care about how big their numbers are, they can find any Finale rip scattered around. Because lets face it, The 1% don't care about RP. They care about being the strongest. And that sometimes comes at the cost of other peoples RP & ruining the storyline to push themselves as a "main character". No one outside of them finds this fun because they treat the game like a Fighting game & count the amount of kills / "wins" they got. This in turn will make the game leak players. Tl;dr, I think a system to allow players to catch up to the 1% faster is fine, The less training i do the better so i can focus on actually rping, I just don't want this to be used in a way that'll give them more of an advantage than they already have. Simply put the system I propose does not help the 1% that is online for 21 hours a day as it will only for the 3 hours they are offline. |
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Post by Manlypink on Oct 3, 2019 17:19:48 GMT -8
I 100% Support this idea, because it allows people to catch up, while not coat tailing behind people who are online longer, but it also helps keep everybody caught up, so you don't get situations where 1 person controls the wipe, but you also don't get situations where everybody is super equal.
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Post by Trickz on Oct 3, 2019 17:19:51 GMT -8
I support this idea completely, I love the pros of being online while also acknowledging those who cannot stay online as much. This will balance the gaps between everyone to a fair degree. It's something I would love to see implemented.
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Post by Kadion on Oct 9, 2019 23:27:43 GMT -8
This would be 100x better than 4x gains imo. Allows for diversity in power and it makes it so that you would not fall behind too hard if you can't play as much.
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